My Policy on the Discussion of the Holocaust

by Scott Creighton

I have noticed that some commenters here keep bringing up the holocaust regardless of the topic of the thread I have posted. So I figured I would post my feelings on the subject as a sort of policy statement. I first posted an earlier version of this as a comment but I figure this will be more easily accessible as a post. It is not specifically directed at anyone. It is simply what I feel about the subject.

I’m going too say this about the Holocaust and that is it. And for the record, let’s not turn every thread into a chat about how “true” the holocaust was, shall we?

Many Jewish people ended up in the forced labor camps. Probably more than any other single religion and yes, they were selected because they were Jewish.

But WHY is the question and the answer is simple… because back then, Jews were by and large a left leaning religion who were by a disproportionate rate, teachers, lawyers, doctors and writers.

They were influential. Left leaning “thought” and community leaders. So of course they were targeted by the fascist regime.

But they weren’t the first targeted which is an important distinction in terms of historical understanding and current events.

The communists, the socialists, the disabled, union leaders… they were the first shipped off to labor camps. Not the Jews. And the proof of that you can find in the Holocaust Museum itself, which, if you bother to browse their online facility, you will find a rather rational and somewhat objective (by comparison at least) accounting of these FACTS that I have just laid out for you.

One of the most well known non-Jew in the work camps went there in ’37. He was German Lutheran pastor Martin Niemöller (1892–1984) and he gave a speech about the German intellectual class ignoring the horrors that were unfolding around them in Nazi Germany which, one variation of the poem about the speech goes something like this:

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

There are variations on the speech, this one is a poem from the 50s based on this part of his speech in ’48

When Pastor Niemöller was put in a concentration camp we wrote the year 1937; when the concentration camp was opened we wrote the year 1933, and the people who were put in the camps then were Communists. Who cared about them? We knew it, it was printed in the newspapers.
Who raised their voice, maybe the Confessing Church? We thought: Communists, those opponents of religion, those enemies of Christians – “should I be my brother’s keeper?”
Then they got rid of the sick, the so-called incurables. – I remember a conversation I had with a person who claimed to be a Christian. He said: Perhaps it’s right, these incurably sick people just cost the state money, they are just a burden to themselves and to others. Isn’t it best for all concerned if they are taken out of the middle [of society]? — Only then did the church as such take note. Then we started talking, until our voices were again silenced in public. Can we say, we aren’t guilty/responsible? The persecution of the Jews, the way we treated the occupied countries, or the things in Greece, in Poland, in Czechoslovakia or in Holland, that were written in the newspapers
I believe, we Confessing-Church-Christians have every reason to say: mea culpa, mea culpa! We can talk ourselves out of it with the excuse that it would have cost me my head if I had spoken out.

Niemoller did speak out and he was sent to a work camp for it.

There is absolutely no doubt, the records bare it out, that Jews were sent in large numbers to these slave labor camps and in fact many died in them horrific, pitiful deaths. Perhaps millions did perish. But so did millions of socialists, communists and disabled people and in fact, they were selected for these camps and rounded up well before people of Jewish faith.

And again, you can find the evidence off all of that right there in the Holocaust Museum if you wish to take a peek.

Are the numbers inflated? Yes. By Israelis and Jews living in the rest of the world? Sometimes, yes. Are they inflated by others to make it LOOK like the holocaust was all about a crazy man’s irrational hatred of a particular religion? Yes.

Why?

Because we are a fascist country and the LAST thing our glorious leaders want us to know is that Nazi Germany was nothing more than an extreme version of what is happening in this country right now.

  1. What is one of the first things Reagan did when he took office in 81? Went after the disabled. In 2013 under the Obama administration, they did something very similar when they set out to kick millions of disabled off disability which will force them back into the workforce, if they can find someone who will hire them knowing they are sick (which is unlikely) and prevent them from receiving care (which will eventually kill them). And if you don’t believe that, I can tell you all about it…
  2. What is going on right now in this country, even on the left? The demonization of Russian sympathizers which is eerily similar to the far-right wingers demonization of the dreaded socialist and communists.
  3. The right has been demonizing the trade unions for some time now right?
  4. And the fake left does what in terms of their own ranks? They talk about “purity tests” and demonize anyone who “lets the perfect be the enemy of the good” and scream about how the “far left” kept Hillary Clinton out of the White House.
  5. And who have we replaced the Jews with? A religion that teaches that interest charged on loans is evil and is therefore banned in Muslim countries. In our culture, usury is expected… kinda like “campaign contributions” coming from major corporations we legally call “persons” with all the constitutional rights you as a citizen USED to enjoy. The Muslims don’t adhere to that ideology… much like the Jews didn’t adhere to the ideology of fascism all those years ago.

See a pattern?

I do not prohibit discussions of the holocaust or the subsequent inflation of numbers of victims. But I do strongly suggest you get it right when you discuss it.

I do not want to see the suffering of any people minimized across the world.

That’s why I write this blog.

I expose the cruelty of empire and globalization and neoliberal economic ideology and that has been the mainstay of this website since it’s inception. From Palestinians to Koreans to Chileans to Syrians to Libyans to Americans… I try to expose the wrongs done to people across the world and sometimes across history.

To that end:

  • I will not tolerate the dismissing of the suffering of Jewish people, disabled people, socialist people and people of all other sorts who were cruelly and methodically rounded up by fascists and used as slave labor to support the industry and the military industrial complex of Nazi Germany.
  • I don’t tolerate anyone dismissing the suffering of the Palestinians today any more than I will that of the Jewish people in the 30s.
  • I will not tolerate what I perceive as holocaust revisionism that implies or states no Jews were killed in work camps and the whole thing is a hoax. Discussions like that are designed to discredit websites and I will not permit them here.
  • The cruelty and dishonesty of Zionism does not mean Jews didn’t suffer and die as slave laborers in fascist Nazi Germany so don’t even try to make that connection.
  • The current and ongoing crimes against humanity which Israel is responsible for also does not equate to “the Holocaust is a hoax” so don’t even try to make that connection.

Discuss Israel and World War II and the holocaust to your heart’s content. Discuss exaggerations, disinformation, Zionism and Hasbara propaganda all you like. It is welcomed, not discouraged on this website.

But do not say Jews didn’t die in work camps and don’t say the disabled, the socialists and many others didn’t as well. Wont tolerate it.

There you have it.

Now… let the screeching begin.. 🙂

Advertisements

75 Responses

  1. “Do not say Jews didn’t die in work camps.” ~ S.C.

    I’ve never heard anyone say that. A lot of people died in a lot of camps worldwide. Where are their government-supported museums?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Holocaust_memorials_and_museums

    • “I’ve never heard anyone say that.”

      Do you run this website? Do you see all the comments that are posted before they are removed? Have you been reading every comment for the last 10 years like I have? All 70,444 of them like I have? no?

      Do you think maybe there is a reason you haven’t seen comments like those on this website?

      “A lot of people died in a lot of camps worldwide. Where are their government-supported museums?”

      What difference do you think that makes to the people who suffered and died as slaves in Germany or anywhere else for that matter? And for that matter, there are monuments to Native Americans who were systematically slaughtered here in the states as well as a few to the Africans who were brought over and made to live as slaves their entire lives. Some monuments, but not enough. those are a few. I’m sure there are more.

  2. For quite a while the anger associated with “Never Again” was a core feature of my life. My late brother in law lived across the street from Mila 18 as a child and ran through the sewers to obtain food for his parents. His son wears a necklace with “Never Again” on it.

    Yet as I read and investigated the actual history of holocaust claims there was no choice but to acknowledge that the narrative of systematic extermination via cyanide gas was unsupported. Peter Winter’s book, 6 Million Fact Or Fiction was especially on point. The discovery of “Eisenhower’s Death Camps” following WWII was another pivotal moment. It seems that cruelty was not confined to the Nazi’s and their allies.

    Of course your post doesn’t weigh in on those issues per se Scott and I understand the line you are walking. When I tested the water by discussing Winter’s book with relatives I provoked a meltdown of epic proportion. Human beings aren’t really rationally oriented beyond a certain superficial level. So I can imagine the comments you had to wade through.

    Hopefully we will get to the point where people accept that history can be researched, investigated and discussed on a factual basis. The prevailing narrative in society rests heavily on maintaining a weaponized traumatic reaction that justifies violence done in it’s name. Until we come to understand that the wars of the 20th century were all banker projects, designed and implemented to advance their agenda honest discussion of the larger picture will be impossible.

    • I have posted this before and again I will report that in 1961 I met a man who had been in one of the German camps. He was still a thin as a rail and his head had numerous scars and one large metal plate. His eyes still looked haunted with fear. He talked about the cruelty and lack of food and forced hard labor….. he quietly talked about gas deaths…….
      history can be researched and altered…..
      when all survivors and their families have passed on, then history will be rewritten again.

    • “Human beings aren’t really rationally oriented beyond a certain superficial level.” ~ Julian

      I agree. As I see it, human intellect serves two functions. [1] To solve basic problems. [2] To rationalize emotional judgments, instinctual whims, and irrational indulgences. I am no exception to this phenomenon, but I try to be aware of my participation in it. That said, I asserted that WW II discussions cause rage in most people. Neoliberalism and its lies cause rage in me.

    • I appreciate your concern and I know it to be genuine, but I’m not walking any line.

      I’ve written on this website and I stand by it to this day that in all likelihood, the laborers who helped CDI rig the Twin Towers for demolition were Israeli settler-types. The 5 Israelis arrested that day certainly were.

      I’ve written more about the IDF attacks on Palestine than anyone else I have read, which includes Mondoweisse.

      I’ve exposed the Greater Kurdistan project as being a joint effort between the U.S. and Israel as they are intimately involved with Barzani and the corruption in Iraqi Kurdistan and yes, they hope it translates to Greater Israel in the end.

      And yes, I have even written about how disproportionately the Jewish faith is represented among what I call the masters of the universe: banksters and the like…

      And somewhere along the lines I have written, for those of you who have not been around that long, that I do not believe the camps were “extermination camps” but rather work camps and the whole myth of the systematic eradication of Jews in Nazi Germany was a white washing of the real fascist nature of the regime that we helped create and bring to power.

      I’m on record for all of these things and many others and I don’t see myself as having to curb discussions or my research to suit anyone’s sensitivities. And yeah, I get all sorts of folks coming out of the woodwork when that happens. I’ve been called everything from “Nazi sympathizer” to “revisionist” to “Holocaust denier” to “anti-Semite” and on the other side, I’m a “Hasbara agent”, “limited hangout”, “useful idiot” and a even… “jew”

      I don’t care. Doesn’t bother me. Those comments are still on the site somewhere in the 74,000 waiting for folks to find them if they see fit.

      But again, I have my limits and there are certain things I wont tolerate.

      That said, I didn’t tolerate discussions of no victims at Sandy Hook when I first started covering the story. I saw it as the same kind of deliberate discrediting as the “no planes” 9/11 theories and the “no victims in the Towers” bullshit. They were designed to make us look like heartless assholes and I to this day don’t tolerate that shit here either.

      However, I have since done more research into Sandy Hook and I have come to a different understanding. So it’s not like I am rigid and unwavering on all things.

  3. I don’t know of any revisionist historian who says no Jews died in the labor camps.  To base the argument, as Scott does, on the fact that he receives such comments that he doesn’t post is tantamount to equating the 9/11 architects and engineers with those who say there were no planes, it was all holograms, etc, etc.
    One can’t have one’s cake and eat it: admit that lies and exaggerations were involved while at the same time talk about the “Holocaust.” The “Holocaust” is a package, tightly wrapped, which we are not allowed to open and examine its contents. Attempts to do so have landed some serious historians in jail and ruined them professionally and economically in Europe.
    One can talk about the fate of Jews in the 3rd Reich and argue this or that but if you talk about the “Holocaust” you have implicitly accepted the taboo package: the 6 million, gas chambers, the works It is not negotiable.
    No, there was no “Holocaust,” OK? Yes, many Jews died in labor camps– according to the Red Cross documentation, a number shy of 300,000.

    It is amply documented that Hitler’s intent was not to “exterminate the Jews just for being Jews” but to expel them. Those in doubt can bone up on the Transfer Agreement he negotiated with the zionist leaders who were eager to have as many Jews as possible sent to Palestine.
    The National Socialists believed that Jews were responsible for bolshevism (not only based on the Bolshevik revolution in Russia, but also on the Jewish-led attempt to install communism in Bavaria. Then as now, “ordinary Jews” were solidly behind their tribal elite, hence the nationalists saw them all as the agents of a dreaded disaster.

    Nevertheless, those who understand “fascism” to mean “corporatist dictatorship” and posit economical reasons behind the anti-Jewishness of National Socialists and Germans in general need to bone up on the cultural marxism of the Weimar Republic, all of it led by Jews:

    http://www.veteranstoday.com/2013/09/24/sexual-decadence-weimar-germany/

    It may not be long now before any discussion of the “Holocaust” is punished in the US as it is Europe as a “hate crime” one that even “instigates to genocide”.. Amazon led the way by banning all the revisionist history books it was selling.

    • “I don’t know of any revisionist historian who says no Jews died in the labor camps. To base the argument, as Scott does, on the fact that he receives such comments that he doesn’t post is tantamount to equating the 9/11 architects and engineers with those who say there were no planes, it was all holograms, etc, etc.”

      First of 9/11 Architects and Engineers for Truth has never endorsed such nonsense. Period. That started with Morgan Reynolds, Judy Wood and Stephen Jones with their disinformation group called Scholars for 9/11 Truth.

      Second… you do understand the concept of what it means when a comment is deleted right? That means it’s deleted and gone from the website’s history. You get that right? So I don’t have the ability to drag it out of the history and show it to you. But if there are people who have been around long enough here, I am sure they will vouch for my statement if they remember.

      And in case you and Elizabeth don’t really understand the kinds of comments I am talking about, I am not talking about folks who are proponents of a better, more accurate understanding of fascist Nazi Germany leaving comments like that. I am talking about trolls who will come to places like this one and leave comments saying exactly what I just said in an attempt to make “truthers” look like raving anti-Semites.

      Do you understand? Yes, those comments were left on the site and yes, they have been erased… as they should have.

      That is totally logical and has NOTHING to do with your comparison between me and the likes of Morgan Reynolds… which you didn’t even know the history of.

      And here you are, with a slight variation… as in “no Holocaust” and in fact it wasn’t economic ideology that caused the problems, it was “cultural Marxism” and sexual decadence… led by Jews… and your reference? Veterans Today… a website who’s owner has openly admitted publishes disinformation on a regular basis.

      What’s the headline on that article? “THE CULTURAL TAKEOVER OF GERMANY BY THE JEWS”

      Yeah, thanks for that contribution.

      • “I am talking about trolls who will come to places like this one and leave comments in an attempt to make ‘truthers’ look like raving anti-Semites.” ~ S.C.

        Oh. This casts everything in a totally different light. I was skeptical before, but I am not skeptical now, since I have often seen the same thing myself. I had misunderstood your previous comment. Thanks for the clarification.

        I pretend to be “logical” about this topic, but I felt much better when I saw your clarification. This proves to me that I am just as emotional (irrational?) as anyone else on this topic.

        • in tracing the IP addresses of some of those commenters in the past, I noticed a disturbing trend… many came from Tel Aviv. Of course, recent events regarding the fake bomb threats issued to JCCs around the country bear striking similarities, don’t they?

          As far as the emotional thing goes, I completely understand. As my other comment pointed out, the critical positions I have taken on Israel, AIPAC, the MOTU and the IDF open me up for the same kinds of attacks I am sure you have to put up with as well. So.. I get it. no worries.

    • here is the truth about Godon Duff and Veterans Today from Duff himself:

      About 30% of what’s on Veterans Today is patently false. About 40% of what I write is at least purposefully partially false. Because if I didn’t write false information I wouldn’t be alive. I simply have to do that.” Gordon Duff

      • Sorry for my imprudence, Scott. There is on thing you should keep in mind: the ethnically Ashkenazi businessmen and bankers (including the Rockefellers and Rothschilds) who cashed in on the Weimar Republic’s misery- and yes, they also traded clandestinely with the Nazis afterwards, then finally enriching themselves with WWII- were anything BUT ‘”left-leaning”, “progressive”. Neither are their descendants in the contemporary oligarchy. These are elites- don’t take this as a generalized condemnation of ALL Jews.

    • I thought ariadnatheo and Julian’s comments were pretty consice and well said. Among many of these comments it appears people are skimming past a lot of details in their rush to shout others down. Such a strong drive to link the opinions we hold with our very identities is encouraged by tptb, so that any challenge to our understanding is treated as a personal attack. Divide & conquer. We should work to detach our emotions and be more dispassionate when discussing these things. I think there’s an important distinction to be made between truth and facts as well. Facts are immutable, and are the only useful, reliable things one has when assembling a picture of past events. “Truth” is too ambiguous and personal a concept.

      Having said that, my understanding of Jews in prewar Germany is not that they were targeted because of their progressive leftist ideals. They were overrepresented in pornography, financial shenanigans, subversive social movements, etc.. That is not to say that all or most were involved in these things, indeed I think this was the final era of integrated, ordinary, working class (Ashkenazi) Jews. Most did not support the Zionist project. It was necessary for the elite behind the Zionist project to trap them in the middle by antagonizing the ndsp, and inciting the Zionist social movement, -the Jewish declaration of war on Germany, this was crucial for the transfer agreement as mentioned.

      This is consistent with the tactics used to coerce the Mizrahi Jews from the various ME countries to migrate to Israel following the war. They were perhaps far more peacefully integrated with their Christian and Muslim neighbors for far longer than their European counterparts. The majority rationally rejected the Zionist project, so with a combination of political incitement to alienate them from the gentile population, and false flag antisemitic terrorism, they were eventually driven to “the land without a people”, where they existed as second class citizens due to extreme racism of the Ashkenazi Zionists.

      I don’t doubt the existence of eugenics programs under the Nazi leadership, there is ample evidence they embraced the racial theories which were popular in the US as well, the pro-eugenicists appeared to have free reign here. I’m pretty skeptical of all the Dr Mengle horror stories, there are plenty of contradictory accounts, and in the end I have to wonder if they can be judged any more harshly than the US in that regard, particularly in light of how American Japanese were treated. By most accounts the conditions of the US camps were far worse than German camps before allied invasion.

      Ambitions for world domination don’t really seem to be supported by documentation, but it’s not a subject I have much knowledge of. There were territories lost in the prior war which they moved to re acquire, and large scale atrocities committed against ethnic German peoples in Russia, beyond that I have little knowledge, maybe someone else can add to that. There is ample documentation of the jewishness of the russian revolution, the extensive positions of leadership occupied by Jews including the NKVD, the funding provided by NY Jews, the murder and persecution of Christians, destruction of churches and beating and immolation of priests while synagogues went unscathed, the Jewish “homeland” of Birobidzhan, of leaflets written by Russian Jewish propagandist inciting Russian soldiers to murder and rape Germans. Again, Hitler’s own words are a useful source of information, I don’t see why we oblige in assuming everything he ever said was a cunning lie. I give Ahmedinijad’s words more weight than a Jewish authored and published history textbook.

      As for the conditions in the camps, jewish historians are usually the most valuable in dispelling the myths, and declassified soviet documents support their findings. Mass murder certainly occured by any definition. I think you can differentiate in the photos as to the nature and proportion of those who were actually convicts and those who were allowed freedom of movement to work in the factories. As for commies, handicaps and homosexuals, yes, they were undesirables, but just how widespread or whether it qualifies as extermination or just mere atrocity or injustice I cannot say, but there were enemies of the state, there were “drains on society” and there was moral rot. The people overwhelmingly supported reform, and the people unanimously said they had no knowledge of mass extermination. I certainty don’t think having a theater, swimming pool, day care center, and intramural soccer is consistent with the imagery the word “Auschwitz” is supposed to invoke, so it’s not talked about. In it’s place are delusional homicidal fantasies, and I think that gives lie to who the ultimate victims and perpetrators actually are.

      For everyone saying Hitler extricated Germany from the jaws of international bankers there seems to be someone saying Hitler was a Jew. Involvement of people like Prescott Bush is not to me conclusive proof it was all a scam. I don’t think today’s system is a continuation of Nazi Germany policies or an appropriate comparison, and fascism is a bit watered down and I’ll defined for my taste, but I know what you’re alluding to when you refer to it. We’re working with the facts we have, and until we remove snark and ego from the equasion and present what we have assembled, people will just continue to settle on whatever version they like best.

  4. You misunderstood my comment. I did not compare you to any of the loonies. Neither does anyone suggest –that I’venoticed– that there are loonies posting comments that you have to erase. There is really no need to talk about these types in regard to either the package labeled “Holocaust” or 9/11. It diverts the discussion from where it needs in fact to go.
    You also misunderstood my point about Weimar. I did not discount the economic factor. Nobody can or should: in post WWI Germany there were more than 200 banks and only 14 small ones NOT in Jewish hands. There was FAMINE. But, as I said this was only one side of the problem.
    You needn’t rely on Veterans Today to study the cultural climate in the Weimar republic. You may check it out yourself in other sources, except… wikipedia.
    In general using read-made labels like “fascist” in such a reflex manner that ends up being anything bad with an authoritarian twist does not do service to the intellectual level of the debate.

    • Wasn’t it Karl Marx who said “all that is solid melts into air”?

    • Chelmno
      look up that camp in Germany…..
      the economy in Germany after WW1 was side effect of losing the war and the Depression in US also caused depression all across Europe…..not just Germany……..

    • Lasha does a disservice to the memories of Weimar Germany by inserting race-baiting, religious fundamentalism (the best men and women of God are those who accept that not everyone shares their beliefs), anti-masturbation (of all the things wrong with the world) and anti-gay rhetoric into her piece. I won’t convince you that some of your beliefs are prejudices, but Atheism and what consenting people above the age of majority do in their bedrooms aren’t worth mortifying yourself over.

      • “in their bedrooms “…
        What you ignore is just about everything you should know about cultural marxism. For one thing, keeping it “in the bedroom” is equated with the “bourgeois oppression” by the “cis-gendered.”

  5. «The communists, the socialists, the disabled, union leaders…» Yes, I support this view. When holocaust is discussed, everybody forgets this. Also, the gipsies, the homossexuals. Though, when war started against the Soviet Union, the Germans had a straight order to kill every communist party member they could find. The Russian prisioners who were sent to Auschwitz were shot dead in the so called «black wall». Everybody forgets this.

    On the killing of Jews in the Soviet Union there is a book written by James S. Levine and Ilya Ehrenburg, with the title «Black Book: The Ruthless Murder of Jews by German-Fascist Invaders Throughout the Temporarily-Occupied Regions of the Soviet Union[…]
    Unfortunately, the copy is very expensive, but to be accurate about the war and the times we were living, this book might be interesting.

  6. Scott I was wondering what is your take on other events/tragedies such as for example what happened in the Gulag under Stalin? I’m not trying to bait you or equate you with anything.

    Don’t take this an attack or me saying, “OMG the ebil socialimz. Socialism=hitler guize, heil freemarket fascism! I love neoliberalism because of the ebil socialists.”

    Or something stupid like that, I am just curious what your policy is on that and on for example the Khmer Rouge in Cambodia.

    Alot of socialists I talk to will tell me falt out that Pol Pot was a complete monster and its socialists like John Pilger that went to Cambodia after the fall of the Khmer Rouge and did a documentary on the “Year Zero” in Cambodia.

    Once again don’t try to equate this with me saying, “OMG evil commies, reds under the beds”, no this isn’t a disucssion
    on that and I am not here nor am I going to start to demonize the USSR or communism.

    However I feel with the case of 9/11 truth along with the Sandy Hook truther crowd that says “No one died and it was all fake” I think the samething applies for example with the Khmer Rouge or any other major event/tragedy, it just makes us look like heartless assholes and it
    discredits leftwing movements with people saying, “Wow look at these leftist assholes denying the crimes of Pol Pot.”

    Maybe the Khmer Rouge and Stalin was a bad example, but I couldn’t think of anything else at the moment.

    One final question, why did Hitler and the Nazis speak of Judeo-Bolshevism and made the argument that Jews were behind communism?

    • Why not debate the intense anti-communist propaganda, since 1917? For example, why not debate the «forgotten war» of 1919, where US troops were photographed in Vladivostok? Some of the things that are being said against Soviet Russia today, were being told by the nazi propaganda before the war.

    • If Hillary Clinton, Steven Rapp, Samantha Power, Deputy Prime Minister Sok An and a United Nations-backed court found the leadership of Khmer Rouge guilty of crimes against humanity in 2014… who am I to disagree? “David Scheffer, the UN Secretary-General’s special expert to the court, said, “Today, the winds of international justice swept through the rice fields of Cambodia, through its cities, its villages, its forests.”

      And we all know Hillary Clinton, Samantha Power and the UN are all about “international justice” now don’t we?

      It’s pretty handy isn’t it? Kinda like today I have to write about “red line” being crossed in Syria less than a week after Sec. Tillerson said we should let the people of Syria decided what happens to their leadership. Well, we all know how they will vote… so along comes another chemical weapons attack (or maybe it doesn’t) and suddenly outlets like CNN and MSNBC are practically begging for an invasion. Handy right? handy for the deep state that’s at war with Trump over his non-aggressive foreign policy in Syria maybe.

      Let’s take a look at the timing of the genocide of the Khmer Rouge, shall we?

      In the late 40s and early 50s the Cambodians threw off the shackles of the French imperialist colonists, same ones who were enslaving the Vietnamese and the same ones we went there to back up.

      In March of 1970, the U.S. installed a neoliberal dictator who would do our bidding and keep the people of the country poor and without a voice in the leadership of Cambodia. We did that via an ILLEGAL and SECRET BOMBING CAMPAIGN called Operation Menu (March 1969 – May 1970)

      The Khmer Rouge started as a populist uprising against that new dictator and as it rose to power, Nixon and Kissinger launched ANOTHER illegal bombing campaign in Cambodia in an effort to wipe them out and keep our dictator in power.

      This campaign, following on the heels of MENU, continued for another 3 years in secret.

      “The United States dropped upwards of 2.7 million tons of bombs on Cambodia, exceeding the amount it had dropped on Japan during WWII (including Hiroshima and Nagasaki) by almost a million tons. During this time, about 30 per cent of the country’s population was internally displaced.”

      “Estimates vary widely on the number of civilian casualites inflicted by the campaign; however,as many as 500,000 people died as a direct result of the bombings while perhaps hundreds of thousands more died from the effects of displacement, disease or starvation during this period.” source

      A million more tons of bombs than they dropped in the fire bombing of Japan at the end of WWII. Or course back then we used napalm and Agent Orange to defoliate the agriculture of the country, which led to catastrophic starvation levels.

      The official story is that we left or stopped bombing in 1973 but it later became known we continued a secret SECRET bombing campaign up until 1975 when Kissinger’s dictator, Lon Nol, was finally overthrown by the Khmer Rouge.

      What always happens after we lose a battle to regime change or one of our dictators is deported, is the press starts to regurgitate State Department propaganda about the new regime. They kill everybody, the commit genocide, they throw out Big Business and steal the wealth of the nation and so forth and so on. How much of that is true in this case? I don’t know..

      But I do know, Cambodia had a perfectly good government BEFORE we started bombing them in 1969 and EVERYONE ADMITS… Nixon’s brutal bombing campaign created and then strengthened the Khmer Rouge, so what happened afterward, well, I guess you can say to some degree, that is on us as well right?

      Here’s a little more about Kissinger since you wish to talk about the Khmer Rouge without mentioning ONCE what he did:

      Pakistan’s genocide in East Pakistan (now Bangladesh), which Kissinger greenlighted: Between 300,000 and a million.

      The U.S.’s illegal bombing campaign in Cambodia: 100,000 civilians dead in the bombing. 1,671,000 killed in the resultant genocide.

      Indonesia’s invasion and occupation of East Timor, which Kissinger greenlighted: 200,000 dead

      Chile: at least 3,000

      Kissinger’s hardline in southern Africa – in response to movements of national liberation in Angola and Mozambique and anti-white supremacy struggles in Rhodesia and South Africa — led him to support allied insurgencies. We might wish,” Ford’s secretary of defense James Schlesinger said during one 1975 strategy session, “to encourage the disintegration of Angola.” And that’s what Kissinger did. In July, he stepped up covert aid to UNITA, a pro-American, anti-MPLA insurgency in Angola that he had already been running. Likewise in Mozambique. All told, historians guess that these wars killed between 1,750,000 and 2 million people.

      I don’t know what the Khmer Rouge did during their stint in power in Cambodia. Probably wasn’t good. I doubt it even comes close to what Nixon and Kissinger did but that’s just a guess because as we all know, after we get kicked out of a country, all sorts of propaganda has to follow.

      I can tell you this with certainty though: none of it would have happened without Nixon and Kissinger and millions of tons of US bombs. That’s for damn sure.

    • and to further my point… we blew the shit out of Iraq, right?

      we installed a neoliberal dictator who ruled with an iron fist, Maliki, right?

      A movement opposing him took shape after our withdrawal from Iraq right?

      That movement was brutally crushed by Maliki on behalf of our “national interests”, right?

      The General Military Council for Iraqi Revolutionaries began a shooting war against Maliki and they started winning, right?

      We decided to call them “ISIS”, make a bunch of fake beheading videos, call them monsters and do all that so Obama could be justified going BACK into Iraq, right?

      Had they won and kicked Maliki out of Iraq, what do you think the stories would have been about in the wake of that?

      And wasn’t Gaddafi regime changed because he was “about” to commit genocide against his own people?

  7. About 60 to 70 million human beings were killed during world war two, but the supposed 10 percent is the most important part. And the Jewish Bolsheviks in Russia killed millions of Russians. Their bastard Soviet state seventy year rule have a body count of about 150 million dead human beings. US, British and German government/military helped the Bolsheviks come in and to stay in power. Without US financial support Soviet would have collapsed in a couple of years. Since world war two US have a direct or indirect body count of about 15-20 million of dead black, brown, yellow and white human beings. But that is not so important. Lets resurrect Hitlers ghost, make a bunch of heart-gripping movies and bemoan the little tiny but sooooo important part of this human tragedy.

    • When you say 150 million dead human beings, on what are you basing your information? Is it US propaganda? Is it Robert Conquest’s reports on Russia? Are you basing your numbers on lies?

      • Say Lenin killed about 5-10 millions and Stalin another 20-30 millions. That is about 25 to 40 million human beings slaughtered by their own government. The figure 25, 40 or 150 millions is not really so important. It is the deaths by the millions that counts. But let me guess. Your are som leftist felling a bit offended that your red idols were worse than the “monster” Hitler, right? You leftist don’t care about human suffering or human deaths. The only thing your care about is your shitty politics.

        • What I am asking you to do is to give the source of your information. It is very simple to do. You just check the number you read from the books you have. Where did you get the number of 25 to 40 million from? Also, look at the logics. If the Soviet Union had a population of 250 million at the time, the slaughter that you say that happened did not leave anybody to fight Hitler, right? Check your figures. Finally, and considering your point of view, if I am a leftist on this issue, you are just another right-wing fascist.

          • I have read a lot of “sources” and Lenin, Stalin and Mao was mass murderers. Leftists tend to forget this when whining about Hitler and the “Holocaust”. But I’m neither right-wing fascist nor leftist-wing fascist. The right and left is a pure bullshit story to divide humans and to get them to fight. I don’t believe in the political system at all.

            The Soviet-union was a test run for the global NWO slave state. But it went belly up. Test run version two is China where they combine communism and capitalism. The future of mankind. And the source of this is my own head and the process i called “thinking”. Leftist tend to forget this process to. And BTW, have you ever wondered why people like Rockefeller are such strong supporters of socialism?

            And about your leftist illogic. If the Soviet Union had a population of 250 million and killed 40 million it’s still 210 millions left. About half of them where males and so we have 105 millions and lets say one fifth where able to fight Hitler it would still be an army of 21 million. Was it to fast? Read it again.

            • You see what you want to see. Neither will convince each other. Maybe the facts are somewhere in between. And would the NWO, if it is to be the dominant paradigm, be so marginalized from the mainstream of American politics, to the point where you can’t mention either brown or red ideology in polite company?

            • “…when whining about Hitler and the “Holocaust”.” wow. Writing about Nazi Germany and the horrors of WWII is now considered “whining”?? lol

              • Wasn’t aiming at you. 🙂 But people from the left tend to piss me of when they “whine” about Hitler and then go on defending or downplay other atrocities, because those murderers have a political view in line with their one. I don’t care about the perpetrators political views. I only look at the suffering they cause. If somebody point their finger at one murderer but omit another, then they are dishonest. I don’t like dishonest people because they make discussions fruitless.

                • yeah, but don’t you think you could pick a better word other that “whine”? I hate to say the word “optics”, I really do… but the optics (cough cough) on that one aint so good. 🙂

                  • But “whine” is a perfect word describing a grown up child with tears in his eyes because someone told him his little “red fairytale” is bogus.

            • Well, some of my sources are the historians V. N. Zemskov, A. N. Dougin and O. V. Xlevjnik. They are not communists. These historians studied the archive of the Soviet Union in 1991, after the Soviet implosion.
              For example, between 1937 and 1938 the number of prisoners sentenced to death was about 100,000 and not the approximately 7 million as some of the misrepresentants reported.
              Among those who worked on the false numbers of millions of dead are Joseph Goebbels, William Randolph Hearst, Robert Conquest, Solzhenitsyn, the son of Krutschev (100 million) and most recently Zbigniew Brzeziński.
              I pity your thought and «perspective» to meet so many liars.

              • How about the artificial famines in Soviet, Ukraine and China? They are not archives as “prisoners sentenced to death”, but it was indeed a death sentence to a lot of people. But your are cherry picking things of what I wrote. There is no real right or left. Right? There is only the one percent and the rest of us. The Soviet Union would have gone belly up real fast without the money from dear old USA. The Jewish banker Jacob Shiff sponsored Lenin and Trotsky from the beginning. Rockefeller, Ford and so on built factories in Soviet. USA helped “uncle Joe” during WW2. It is about the one percents Hegelian Dialectics creating opposite sides. You can’t have conflict and wars without an enemy. Wars are only there to grind down the ones that are willing to take up arms and whats left are the fat fucks in front of the TV.

                Journalist lie about what happened yesterday or last week. Historians lie about what happened a century or millennia ago. As long you and I have not been there when it happened yesterday or a millennia ago – we only have other peoples opinion to go by. Your bullshit is not better than mine and mine is not better than yours. But I am not defending murderers – You are.

              • Well, but 100,000 killed in one year is about 274 human beings slaughtered each day every day for a whole year. And that is not so bad because I, in pity thought, thought it was much worse.

                I am so sorry and I repent. Your red idols really where angels of light and the earthly manifestation of pure love and compassion. You convinced me and I will dedicate the rest of my humble life to spread the word of peace, love and communism.

                • 274 people a day? I got that beat. The “holocaust” claims that the Germans gassed an average of 4,110 innocent Jews every single day for four years. (Six million / 1460 days = 4,110). That’s 170 every hour round the clock every day for four years, with no breaks.

                  • I don’t think the “Holocaust” was as it’s claimed to have been. Auschwitz had a soccer-field and a brothel. I remember a interview with a “survivor” when he got a question about the soccer-field he looked like a embarrassed child. The soccer-field doesn’t play well with the extermination part. Did they play soccer and then run to the “showers” or what? And Auschwitz have downgraded the body-count from four millions to 1.5 millions – but still six million Jews died. If six million died with the old body-count and then you have a new body-count with 2.5 million less, the new body-count should be 3.5 million Jews gassed. But it’s still the magical six millions. If you have six apples and you subtract 2.5 apples – you have 3.5 apples. This is kindergarten mathematics.
                    https://furtherglory.wordpress.com/2010/12/20/why-do-the-numbers-for-auschwitz-birkenau-keep-changing/
                    But I to believe a lot of Jews died during WW2, but as i wrote in my first comment so did about 60-70 million other souls. Why should the supposed 3.5 million dead Jews be the most important ones? When downgraded they only amount to five percent of the total.

                    • “Auschwitz had a soccer-field and a brothel.” Correct. Auschwitz also had a theatre for plays and movies, plus a public swimming pool (which is still there), a medical clinic, stores, a post office, its own currency, vegetable gardens, and day care for children. It was effectively a wartime industrial park, although the people who lived and worked there had to get permission before coming and going. No one denied these facts until Israel’s Six Day War of Aggression in June 1967, after which the Israelis modified the Auschwitz narrative. I realize that it is blasphemy for me to note these things. In human society there is nothing as blasphemous as the truth. Everyone is free to flame me about this. In order to give them the last word, I will not respond.

                    • modern day for-profit prisons have stores, mail, medical clinics, basketball courts, recreational facilities, gardens… and some that house female inmates have day care for children along with their maternity wards. They are starting programs where they bring in cats and stray dogs for the inmates to care for. Some even have halls where they show weekly movies.

                      But they still use the inmates as slave labor and corporations still profit from their forced labor.

                      Let me ask you a question… you say this is what Auschwitz had… how many other labor camps in Germany had those? How many others of the 100s that were set up across eastern Europe had those?

                      Are you aware enough to realize that when the camps were first conceived the Nazi’s knew how they would be perceived so they included these things in their flagship operation so they could show the world how benign they were?

                      Are you aware enough to understand simple fact?

                      Are you also aware enough to see a slave owner who says “See look. I take good care of my slaves” is still a piece of shit slave owner?

                      Are you aware enough to understand these simple and obvious things while you leave these comments on my website?

                    • @elizabethharris001. This is exactly my point to. One, or many bad things, don’t justify other bad things. The supposed victim becomes the oppressors by stating “never again” and “kill the Arabs” in the one and same sentence. It is as an empty defense as the pedophile stating “as a child, I was molested to”. It is both cynical and revolting to use your fellow human beings suffering to gain some political agenda. The Jews them self have a saying that goes something like “a Jews worst enemy is another Jew”. Jews happily sacrifice their “lesser brethren” of both Ashkenazi and Semitic origin, with emphasis on the later, and they are very very racist to. By stating Jews are racist probably makes me an “antisemitic” and that’s the worst kind of racist. As usual. 🙂

                    • some Jews are racist. My uncle Al was not. Ergo, blanket statements like you just made are a gross generalization, lumping an entire body of people into one category based entirely on their religion. What that makes you is between you and your conscience. But you don’t get to hide behind the Hasbara tactic of yelling “anti-Semite” when someone calls out specific policies of a specific government. Yes that exists. Yes, some Jewish people, like some Christians, some Muslims, some atheists, are racists. If you honestly feel they are all such due to the only evidence you have, that someone is Jewish, then that makes you what it makes you… regardless of Hasbara.

                      If you are to dim to understand that, you are hanging out at the wrong website.

                    • @willoman. I didn’t mean all Jews are racist, but some of them are very racist and specially toward Arabs. And many, but not all, Ashkenazi Jews treat their fellow Semitic Jews in a bad way. And this is from books written by Jews. And then their is Jews that are honest and good and they have all the other characteristic of nice human beings. Do I really have to spell all these thing out?

                    • Yeah, as a matter of fact, as you’re commenting about “the Jews” you could occasionally remind readers that these are not blanket statements. that would be nice.

                    • @willyloman. I understand all those things and if you think I am defending Hitler and Nazism – you got me wrong. I think it’s as bad as all the rest of the human suffering caused by other political views. I don’t know what really happened during WW2 and in the camps. Neither do I really know what happened in Russia during the revolution and there after. The only point I’m trying to make is that I question the official story because it is inconsistent. The real truth is hard to find and whats left are a lot of different perspectives.

                    • I as well question parts of the official story of the Holocaust, as I have made perfectly clear over the years running this website, which, by the way, I stand behind 100% as I post all of my work proudly, right alongside my real name. Not that others have to or should… but let’s make that distinction perfectly clear, shall we?

                      There are different perspectives and I welcome discussion of them. You are still here as is Elizabeth, though you both clearly come at this topic from a different perspective than mine.

                      “I understand all those things and if you think I am defending Hitler and Nazism – you got me wrong.”

                      That said, when you use terms like “red fairytale” when you constantly demean “the Jews” and you downplay the horrors of fascist Nazi Germany, you’re starting to sound a lot like a Goebbels acolyte which diminishes your message above, if that really is your message.

                    • @willyloman. In your comparison with the for-profit US prison system and Auschwitz you make an excellent point. Yes, both of them have the characteristics of slave labor camps – but they don’t exterminate inmates in US prisons either. But inmates do die i the US prison system and that’s without a raging world war around the corner. So maybe Auschwitz only was a slave labor camp and not an extermination camp. This is the only thing i question and the numbers and methods.

                    • I have never said it was an extermination camp. It was, to my knowledge, a forced labor camp just as all the others were. IMHO.

                      That said… I wonder what is worse? Killing someone quickly, horribly but quickly… or forcing them to suffer for years and die eventually on behalf of some massive corporation raking in profits on your suffering and death?

                      As monstrous as the genocide against the Native Americans was by my own forefathers, I have to wonder if in some small way, that wasn’t preferable to what those same forefathers did to Africans they imported from across the sea?

                      In many ways I believe the “extermination camps” story is a sort of cover for the real, lasting horror of the work camps. But again, I don’t claim to be an expert on the subject.

                      And with that, I am going to leave discussion on this thread to you guys because I posted it, not to discuss the relevant truth or fiction of the holocaust but instead to post my website’s policy on the discussion of such matters.

                    • @willyloman. You have a point with my comment about “red fairytale” and it was to annoy my leftist friend Jorge. And I forgot to spell out the “brown Nazi fairytale”. But I did spell out the one percents “Hegelian Dialectics” where Nazis, communists, white, brown, yellow, Jews and all other humans of different colors where the ones being killed. But you are cherry picking to.

                    • Well, ok Scott, but are you aware that Auschwitz is not the only camp the red cross inspected?

                      To call it a flagship operation for the purpose of pulling the wool over the eyes of the international community I think is a bit of a stretch. Were they conducting tours? The onus now is for you to investigate whether these amenities were absent at other camps to support your public facade theory before you’re uncivil toward those who dare contradict you.

                      Were all here for our mutual enlightenment, not to be told debate is unwelcome and our contributions are stupid.

                • About your last sentence to me, I think that cynicism belongs to those who despair in their arguments.
                  On hunger in Ukraine, without realizing it, you are following in the footsteps of Joseph Goebbels’ propaganda.
                  If you want to get a better idea about this, it’s best to read the book “Fraud, famine and fascism – the Ukranian genocide from Hitler to Harvard” by the Canadian journalist Douglas Tottle.
                  I hope that in the future you will try to study these facts better, instead of being lazy and careless in words.

                  • Now you using your leftist illogic again. Your sources are the correct ones and those contradicting your own political believes are “propaganda”. As I stated in an earlier comment. Both journalists and historians tend to lie to justify some coming or played out agenda. If you or I wasn’t there we only have their “word of honor” that they are telling us the truth.

                    But you didn’t notice that I caught you with your pants around your ankles and egg on your face? You proven yourself to be a soulless and empty red party pamphlet with the statement that they only killed 100,000 human beings in one year. You had no problems with this what so ever. This is called a mental shack mate, my dear red little fellow. Better luck next time.

                    • «My dear red little fellow»… Where has this expression come from? It sounds a bit like Joseph Goebbels to me. You didn’t catch me with my pants down. Actually, I caught you lying like capitalists did, exagerating in numbers. I only tried to be more accurate in the numbers, according to those who studied the archives. As I told you before, you need to be more aware of the facts and dedicate yourself to reading and respecting your opponents, when their facts are right. Otherwise, you will live in a world of misunderstandings. But I won’t bother with you any longer. You are just another idiot who seeks attention.

                    • Just for the record, the U.S. government had 152 forced labor camps during WW II for U.S. citizens who declined to die in the war. Victims were held until two years after the war ended. These camps were separate from POW camps, and from concentration camps for U.S. citizens of Japanese ethnicity. They were not extermination camps, but neither was any camp in the world during the war, although the Soviet gulags sometimes came close.
                      http://civilianpublicservice.org/campsoverview

                    • that’s a little more than dishonest, don’t you think? these “forced labor” camps you are talking about were for men who were conscientious objectors to the war. They weren’t rounded up at gunpoint and dragged there, they went there as a penalty for not fighting in the bankster’s war. they weren’t starved, they didn’t die by huge numbers. it’s a spurious comparison at best, Liz. PLUS… the work they did, according to the site you list as a reference, was NOT for big businesses using slave labor to make profits.

                      “Selective Service, in consultation with the National Service Board of Religious Objectors (NSBRO), approved the type of work determined by the various government agencies to be “work of national importance” due to labor shortage during the war. Of the 67 base camps, 30 were operated by the Forest Service and 19 by Soil Conservation Service.”

                      Plus the pictures that they show of the camps are VASTLY different than the concentration camps the Nazis ran. Not even a close comparison. you’re better off talking about the Japanese internment camps.

                      http://civilianpublicservice.org/people

                    • I wish I could respond, but (and this is not a cop-out) there is not enough space to discuss this topic here. I will only say that for me (unlike many others) the Empire’s lies and hypocrisy in the past are as false, self-righteous, and murderous as are the Empire’s lies and hypocrisy today. National Socialist Germany opposed the evil Empire. This does not make it righteous but it does not make N.S. Germany supremely evil either. Anyone who says otherwise is a defender of the Empire. Just my opinion, of course.

                    • We both agree that Russia today is not a savior, but a competitor. However we do not agree regarding N.S. Germany. For me it was a competitor. For others it was pure evil, and the Empire was a savior. I do not see things that way. In any case, my enemy today is neoliberalism.

          • I’m Ashkenazi, a former newscaster, I’m a bio chemist yes a typical overachieving Jew. And I’m from New York! I’m sure this guy is going to just love me LOL I am conservative however. I’d like to ask him to please not accept any medical or pharmaceutical advancements that The Ashkenazi have provided to the human race. If he’s going to be an anti-Semite even a subtle one, please go all the way!

            • is anyone supposed to be bothered that you’re a jew? maybe you have the wrong webpage — or maybe you’re just a zionist.

  8. “European Jews were, and are, part of European colonialism and imperialism. Where we made the mistake is to separate the two! European Jews are Europeans. When Europeans move, European Jews also move. They move not because they are Jewish, they move because they are white. They are Europeans, and that is a thing that we must understand, they have played a good game. And nobody wants to deal with the fact that Jews were equally slaveholders as well as Christians and Moslem Arabs.” – Dr. Yosef Ben-Jochannan

  9. “America was Nazi Germany’s role model…German racial theorists clearly believed it was important to focus especially on the United States to argue that Germany was not alone in its efforts to protect and preserve racial purity…Germany’s leading racial hygiene journal reported the refusal of the American Medical Association to admit Black physicians to its membership; 5000 Black physicians had petitioned to join the all-white American body but were turned down…According to a Bulletin of the History of Medicine article entitled “The Physician versus the Negro,” the belief in the Negro’s extinction became one of the most pervasive ideas in American medical and anthropological thought during most of the late nineteenth century. Doctors theorized that the effect of emancipation had been, “too overwhelming for the race.”

    “That the immediate emancipation of the Southern Negro was a most deplorable event in the history of that unhappy race has become quite manifest,” wrote one physician. “The only hope for the southern end of the United States is just these forces that are tending to exterminate the Negro.” Doctors suggested that society should help that process of extinction along…In depopulating a continent during the American slave trade, doctors participated in the selection process.”
    http://upalumni.org/medschool/appendices/appendix-65a.html

    • It is reported that the triumph of eugenic sterilization programs in the United States during the 1930’s influenced Germany to enact their own sterilization laws*….Nazi physicians on more than one occasion argued that the German racial policies were relatively ‘liberal’ compared with the treatment of Blacks in the United States… [where] a person with 1/32nd black ancestry was legally black, whereas if someone was 1/8th Jewish in Germany… that person was legally Aryan.”
      http://upalumni.org/medschool/appendices/appendix-65a.html

      • “While the Israeli state espouses multiculturalism and diversity, it oppresses not just the Palestinian population, but also any Black person within its borders…Israel’s treatment of Black people reveals that the Zionist project is not just about Jewish supremacy, but also white supremacy.”

  10. “The German government is not happy with the unearthing of its dark and chilling colonial past, as it aims to pay its final installment by Sunday of about 60 million pounds, officially ending the reparations imposed by the Allies after World War I, which ended 92 years ago in 1918. The Hereros’ fruitless quest for reparations from the German government cuts to the heart of the burning land question in Namibia.”
    http://www.newkerala.com/news/world/fullnews-52180.html

    http://www.artsci.wustl.edu/~anthro/courses/306/herero.html

    http://www.newsfromafrica.org/newsfromafrica/articles/art_10194.html

      • “The ongoing African Holocaust is denied, ridiculed, mocked, and deemphasized daily without any global sympathy…For 500 years Africans have been on the receiving end of historical racism culminating in the final Great Holocaust of chattel enslavement in the Americas yet nothing exists in any language to speak directly to this ongoing Holocaust…Dogs, lynch mobs, hoses, apartheid, slavery, genocide, mustard gas, HIV experiments, gene warfare (created by Israel and Apartheid South Africa) and yet no word exists to describe the peculiarity of this ongoing and unrelenting African oppression.”
        http://www.africanholocaust.net/news_ah/jewishslave2.html

        • Very good, Modmutha. Let’s also not forget the holocaust of King Leopold in Congo. Terrible it was and European people still forget it. While prefering to discuss gulags in Russia and numbers, they whitewash the biggest crime that happened in Africa by the hands of the European colonizers. The concentration camps started in South Africa and they were invented by Baden Powell.

  11. I thought ariadnatheo and Julian’s comments were pretty consice and well said. Among many of these comments it appears people are skimming past a lot of details in their rush to shout others down. Such a strong drive to link the opinions we hold with our very identities is encouraged by tptb, so that any challenge to our views is treated as a personal attack, and we continue to argue with each other forever. We should work to detach our emotions and be more dispassionate when discussing these things. I think there’s an important distinction to be made between truth and facts as well. Facts are immutable, and are the only useful, reliable things one has when assembling a picture of past events. “Truth” is too ambiguous and personal a concept.

    My understanding of Jews in prewar Germany is not that they were targeted because of their progressive leftist ideals. As now, they were overrepresented in pornography, financial shenanigans, subversive social movements, etc.. That is not to say that all jews or most jews were involved in these things, indeed I think this was the final era of integrated, ordinary, working class (Ashkenazi) Jews. Someone needed to give them a good reason immigrate and the zio’s obliged.

    Given the many thousands of Jews who worked in government and military under the Nazi regime, I think the argument can be made that the party opposed the Jews primarily as a political movement. [Jews are the only group who define themselves as a religion, a race, and a culture or political movement, and they go from one identity to the other as it suits their motives, and some readily state this. This I think is a very important point to understand. It doesn’t matter that secular atheist Jews don’t read the Talmud and Torah, their raised in a culture of exclusivity and privilege taking, and yes, the percentage of racist Jews in occupied Palestine is so high you really can make blanket statements about them. Maybe you should read and watch more Gilad Atzmon, he’s a very upright and decent man and his insight into the Jewish culture and mindset is remarkable and his frankness is refreshing.]

    This is consistent with the tactics used to coerce the Mizrahi Jews from the various ME countries to migrate to Israel following the war. They were perhaps far more peacefully integrated with their Christian and Muslim neighbors for far longer than their European counterparts. The majority rejected the Zionist project, so with a combination of political incitement to alienate them from the gentile population, and false flag ‘antisemitic’ terrorism, they were eventually driven to “the land without a people”, where they existed as second class citizens due to extreme racism of the Ashkenazi Zionists.

    I don’t doubt the existence of eugenics programs under the Nazi leadership, there is ample evidence they embraced the racial theories which were popular in the US as well, the pro-eugenicists appeared to have free reign here. I’m pretty skeptical of all the Dr Mengle horror stories, there are plenty of contradictory accounts, and in the end I have to wonder if they can be judged any more harshly than the US in that regard, particularly in light of how American Japanese were treated. By most accounts the conditions of the their camps were far worse than German camps before allied invasion.

    They had extraterritorial ambitions, but world domination doesn’t really seem to be supported by documentation, it’s not a subject I have much knowledge of. There were territories lost which they moved to re acquire, maybe someone else can add to that. Hitler’s own words are a useful source of information, I don’t see why we oblige in assuming everything he ever said was a cunning lie. I give Ahmedinijad’s words more weight than a Jewish authored and published history textbook.

    There is ample documentation of the jewishness of the russian revolution, the extensive positions of leadership occupied by Jews including the NKVD, the funding provided by NY Jews. Mass atrocities were committed against ethnic German peoples in Russia, murder and persecution of Christians, destruction of churches and beating and immolation of priests while synagogues went unscathed, the Jewish “homeland” of Birobidzhan, of leaflets written by Russian Jewish propagandist inciting Russian soldiers to murder and rape Germans.

    Jewish historians are usually the most valuable sources, and there are plenty of references to rely on. Mass murder certainly occured by any definition. I think you can differentiate in the photos as to the nature and proportion of those who were actually convicts and those who were allowed freedom of movement to work in the factories. Photos of bodies stacked like cordwood and mass graves were of typhus deaths, Germany actually took pride in having the lowest mortality in their camps of any country during the war. Mortality skyrocketed near the end as allies cut supply routes, and it rose further when the allies took control. General Patton wasn’t happy with the things he saw and soon died in a low speed car wreck (head bashed in if I recall). As for commies, handicaps and homosexuals, yes, they were “undesirables”, but just how widespread or whether it qualifies as extermination or just mere atrocity or injustice should be open to inquiry rather than assumed as fact, but there were enemies of the state, there were “drains on society” and there was moral rot. The people overwhelmingly supported reform, and the people unanimously said they had no knowledge of mass extermination. Far from being a nation driven by irrational hatred, in the 1936 Olympics ” Jesse Owens had encountered far less discrimination in Germany than he did back in his own country” in his own words he described the enthusiastic reception he received with the crowds who chanted his name. I’d be weary of relying on any data from a Holocaust museum, but the following is direct testimony from Spielberg’s project.

    For everyone saying Hitler extricated Germany from the jaws of international bankers there seems to be someone saying Hitler was a Jew. Everyone else says he was the most evil monster to ever walk the earth. Involvement of people like Prescott Bush is not to me conclusive proof it was all a scam, or that Bush was a nazi. I don’t think today’s system is a continuation of Nazi Germany policies or an appropriate comparison, unless someone can provide information detailing the corporate structures overtaking the national resources, and fascism is a bit watered down and Ill defined for my taste. Not inherently bad, the original fascismo being put forth as a natural extension of the kind of socialism you seem to favor. But, I know what you’re alluding to when you refer to it.

    Were working with the facts we have, and until we remove snark and ego from the equasion and start sharing and cooperating, people will just continue to settle on whatever version they like best. Personally, I spent my life assuming what I was told was true, and Jews were downtrodden victims unfairly persecuted by the rich white false Christian establishment just like everyone else is. Coming to the understanding I have was a process. I wasn’t motivated by hate or prejudice, I didn’t have any preconceptions beyond the official narrative. It started when I encountered a conversation about a Holocaust movie and I was a bit shocked and uncomfortable by what I read. I had *never* encountered any such discussion, and revisionism wasn’t a word I knew, but my curiosity and drive to understand got the best of me, and I wasn’t so rigidly dogmatic that I couldn’t take on a new perspective. I studied and contemplated, and my bullshit detector has grown well refined in the process. I am in fact the only person I know who will readily accept a new reality upon seeing sufficient factual evidence. I’m not wedded to my opinions, I’m not invested in being right all the time. I think it’s more important and useful to learn to accept and admit there are things you don’t know, it’s a remedy for bias. What else is life for but to study and improve, examine the past and correct for the future.

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s

%d bloggers like this: